Mr. Media Interviews by Bob Andelman
Friday, September 14, 2007
Sree Sreenivasan, Columbia University Graduate School of Journalism, New Media Professor: Mr. Media Interview, Pt. 1
I don’t know about you, but I could spend hours on end doing stuff on the Internet, some of it productive, some of it, well, not.
And some days, it’s hard separating the two because one is generally just as distracting as the other.
I’m hoping that today’s guest, Sree Sreenivasan, can help all of us sort out the time-wasters from the time-benefitters. And no, I don’t think that’s a real word.
Sree is one of journalism’s last great multi-taskers. He’s a New Media professor and dean of students in the Columbia University Graduate School of Journalism. But he’s also a technology reporter for WNBC television in New York City and a regular columnist for Poynter Online. Oh, and he is, naturally, a blogger too at sreetips.com.
BOB ANDELMAN/Mr. MEDIA: Sree, Facebook was recently featured on the cover of Newsweek magazine, basically alerting the general public that there was a new cultural phenomenon upon us or there had been for a while for college kids, I guess. I know you use Facebook, and I wondered if you could start by talking a little bit about how you use it and what the pros and cons of the service might be.
SREE SREENIVASAN: Facebook is one of the sites that you think you don’t need it until you start using it and then you get so addicted very fast. I got a note the other day from a friend I’ve been trying to get on Facebook for a while, and he said, “I have no use for this, I have no use for this.” And then the other day, he wrote me a note saying, “Oh my God, I love this site.”
The way I look at Facebook is, it’s an example of how you can use technology as a great way to reconnect with friends and family and make some new friends. But also it shows you how much of a time thing it can be if you let it get to be that way. And we’re seeing people, including me, who can go on and an hour later, you’re emerging from it, sometimes two hours later from it.
What you do is you go on to Facebook, you create an account, and you start by finding your friends. And you say, “I already have email, why do I need this? I might even be using instant messaging and a cell phone and text messages. Isn’t it just one more thing?” And, in fact, it is one more thing, but it has its own kind of style and its own attractiveness about it that is sort of hard to explain. But it’s very easy to use, and I’ve been reconnecting with friends who I have an email relationship with, but now I see them and talk to them more often on my computer screen than when I just did with email itself.
SREENIVASAN: I think that’s a great way to do it. And whenever you write to someone, make sure you put in a little note explaining why you’re writing and why you’re using this because there are also some other services, including Friendster and Plaxo and all these things, that are just sending out, using your email contacts and connecting you to people sometimes even when you didn’t mean to connect with them. So indicate in some fashion that this is something you are serious about as opposed to some of the other services that you accidentally tried once or just tested out. But, if you’re really into this, let them know, and then your friends will follow you there.
ANDELMAN: Do you have any personal stories of people you’ve reconnected with through Facebook, in particular?
SREENIVASAN: Yes. I reconnected with some of my younger cousins through Facebook. Sometimes -- and this is also an example of how you can be careful about it -- there’s one particular cousin who I connected with, and we’re now emailing a lot more than I did before or Facebooking a lot more than we did before. But I also noticed that, as everyone in her generation, she’s putting up photographs and putting up details of her life that no older cousin should know about, mainly so that I have a kind of plausible deniability from my uncle and aunt. If they ever ask me, “So how is so and so doing, what is she up to?” I can say I don’t know. So I have often gone into people’s photographs which they’ve put and then I suddenly back out and try to erase it from mind’s hard drive.
That’s just one of the ways I’ve been using it, but I’ve also been using it as a great way to communicate with former classmates and also my current students. You can form what are called groups on Facebook, and then you can set up a group, and people will find you, and they’ll populate your pages. And it’s sort of connecting with friends of friends and sharing photographs, and you wonder what did people do before they had this. Well, the answer is they had something else and before that, something else, and before that, something else. And we’ll see if Facebook becomes something that lingers on for a long time or is just a momentary thing the way some other websites were.
Another one I like is linkedin.com. I used to call it “Facebook for Adults,” but that sounds too weird so I call it “Facebook for Professionals.” But like Facebook, which itself has now opened itself out, it was only for college students, but in the last year, it has opened itself out. LinkedIn is very good for business contacts.
SREENIVASAN: I think that is a fair assessment. It isn’t as Web 2.0, if you will. It doesn’t feel as kind of new and constantly being updated, and there aren’t photographs. And that’s one of the things I like about LinkedIn is it’s kind of more professional compared to Facebook.
ANDELMAN: Now, your starting point is the same for both of them. As a matter of fact, for a lot of these services is that, if you want to really get into it, you upload your email contacts from your email program. And then once you get in there, it’s fascinating the way these programs do this. They can actually tell you who know who’s already in their network so you can instantly have a network.
SREENIVASAN: Exactly. And that makes a big difference so that you’re not having to start from scratch every time.
ANDELMAN: The thing that I get asked a lot by, like I’ve got 4,000 contacts in my address book, and I’m kinda working my way through them, inviting them on or seeing if they’re already on. But the people who aren’t on, they worry about a couple things. They worry about, “If I upload my address book is that public knowledge?” They wonder, “Am I giving out private information?” And then what they really want to know is, “How on earth can this benefit me?” How can just having a bunch of people in my network be of benefit? And that’s the question. I guess that’s the first one that I really wanted to ask you about that.
SREENIVASAN: Well, I guess there’s sort of two separate questions there. The first, about whether these services will have access to your email or anything else like that. I wouldn’t use the uploads or contacts feature on some brand new site that I know nothing about, but LinkedIn and Facebook are now two real companies and have business models and have privacy policies in terms of service where they promise not to do things like that. And you kind of end up trusting those people in a way you may not trust someone else.
The other thing is that it’s very hard to explain exactly how it’ll benefit, but being in a network is always helpful. And many of us are already in networks, and we just don’t realize it. We’re okay, well, I’m not a social networker online, but we use it for all kinds of things. You’re part of your high school alumni network, you’re part of your college alumni network. If you’re a season ticket holder and you go to the same seats, you’re in a network of people who sit next to you at every game for whatever team you follow. And being part of networks like that has tremendous benefits offline, and those benefits are amplified and some of the problems are amplified online. So you still have to have a good way of using it, a systematic way of using it, but the easiest way is just to try and keep in touch with your friends and family and your closest friends first. Many people say to me, “I don’t want this because I can barely deal with the friends I already have. I don’t want to make any new friends.” And I tell people, “You don’t have to look at it that way. Look at keeping better touch with the friends you already have.”
My wife and I are an example of this. She and I talk on the cell phone a couple of times a day. We text message each other. We email each other. But we’ve now worked Facebook into our routine. And they have this funny little feature called “Poke Somebody,” and what she’ll do is, instead of sending me an email, she’ll go on Facebook and she’ll poke me. What that does is it’s kind of a nudge or an alert. If I’m available and online, I’ll respond, and then we’ll either have an email, phone, or Facebook conversation. If I’m not there, it’ll alert me that she was looking for me. So it’s a very subtle way of using Facebook. It’s not for everybody. But, as we’ve seen, young people are on this and also older people are on. There are Facebook groups for people over fifty, and it’s not an age thing at all.
SREENIVASAN: Yes, and that’s one of the best things about LinkedIn. I have now taken to using LinkedIn exactly in that fashion. In the old days, that is before a couple years ago, if someone said to me, “I’d like to talk to Bob Andelman,” I would just email you and that person, cc: you and say, “Bob, meet Jim.” You’re stuck because, you’re a decent guy, you will feel some kind of obligation to respond to Jim and partly Jim also has your email address now. So now you’re in this kind of loop with Jim even if you didn’t want to be. So instead Jim says, “I’d like to meet Bob.” What I tell him is go to LinkedIn, find Bob on there, and then connect through me. Jim goes home, sets up a LinkedIn account, and then he emails, using the system, he emails a note to you, but it stops at my desk first. I then decide whether it’s worth connecting Jim to you, and I forward it to you. You then see this note, and you have the option of whether you want to respond or not. And if you decide not to respond, no problem. Jim never got your address. And that’s one of the most basic ways in which this works, and that’s what makes it so useful because your email address has not been compromised by me. You are choosing to respond to him or not. And I know many, many cases where I’ve done this with very busy, very important people, and many of them have appreciated this kind of new way of connecting. And it’s different from yet another email in your inbox so that’s why people are looking into things like this.
ANDELMAN: Now, the way we’re talking about these, people might think that we’re thinking of MySpace as yesterday’s news. Personally, to me, it is yesterday’s news. I find it to be very sloppy, very messy, just way too wild for my taste professionally and personally. Is there a backlash going on for MySpace, or am I just too particular about my friends?
SREENIVASAN: Well, MySpace was bought for $800 million, I believe, by Murdoch and the folks over at News Corp, something in that range. And that was because it was one of the biggest sites on the planet at that time, and it’s still very, very big. But I do find it kind of yesterday’s news, partly because it was never meant for people in my age group. It was aimed at much younger folks even though there are people older than me on it. It didn’t have a sense of aesthetics, design, or a kind of welcoming environment.
When I teach technology to my students, I tell them that I can teach you two of the three T’s, the letter T, T for tools, T for technology. I cannot teach you the third T, which is taste. And when you go to a lot of MySpace pages, they look like they’ve been made in fingerpainting class. And so I never felt comfortable. You go to Facebook, there’s a certain, what we call user interface. It’s got a good user interface. The information architecture is nice. But mainly, it’s intuitive and easy to understand.
One other point I’ll make is when we talk about money and the hundreds of millions of dollars that were offered for MySpace. One of the first of these social networking websites was Friendster. And the founder of Friendster turned down a billion dollar buyout a few years ago, and I believe he’s come to regret it since. And Friendster is nowhere near where Facebook is, but in recent weeks, Facebook has turned down or reportedly turned down a $6 billion buyout offer itself. So it will be interesting to see if Facebook ends up like Friendster or ends up like Google. No one knows where it’s gonna go.
I’d also say that we in America tend to be very eccentric about these things. And something like Friendster is very popular outside of America but not used as much in America. Even Google has a product which has not done well in America called Orkut, which almost no American I know of is on but is huge in Brazil. Literally, if you were trying to have the equivalent of a Super Bowl ad in Brazil, you would get it on Orkut, not on Facebook or Friendster or MySpace. So culturally and for other reasons, some other groups are on other services and not necessarily the ones we’re on today. And that might change again in a couple years.
Click Here to Keep Reading!
©2007 by Bob Andelman. All rights reserved.
I don’t know about you, but I could spend hours on end doing stuff on the Internet, some of it productive, some of it, well, not.
And some days, it’s hard separating the two because one is generally just as distracting as the other.
I’m hoping that today’s guest, Sree Sreenivasan, can help all of us sort out the time-wasters from the time-benefitters. And no, I don’t think that’s a real word.
Sree is one of journalism’s last great multi-taskers. He’s a New Media professor and dean of students in the Columbia University Graduate School of Journalism. But he’s also a technology reporter for WNBC television in New York City and a regular columnist for Poynter Online. Oh, and he is, naturally, a blogger too at sreetips.com.
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BOB ANDELMAN/Mr. MEDIA: Sree, Facebook was recently featured on the cover of Newsweek magazine, basically alerting the general public that there was a new cultural phenomenon upon us or there had been for a while for college kids, I guess. I know you use Facebook, and I wondered if you could start by talking a little bit about how you use it and what the pros and cons of the service might be.
SREE SREENIVASAN: Facebook is one of the sites that you think you don’t need it until you start using it and then you get so addicted very fast. I got a note the other day from a friend I’ve been trying to get on Facebook for a while, and he said, “I have no use for this, I have no use for this.” And then the other day, he wrote me a note saying, “Oh my God, I love this site.”
The way I look at Facebook is, it’s an example of how you can use technology as a great way to reconnect with friends and family and make some new friends. But also it shows you how much of a time thing it can be if you let it get to be that way. And we’re seeing people, including me, who can go on and an hour later, you’re emerging from it, sometimes two hours later from it.
What you do is you go on to Facebook, you create an account, and you start by finding your friends. And you say, “I already have email, why do I need this? I might even be using instant messaging and a cell phone and text messages. Isn’t it just one more thing?” And, in fact, it is one more thing, but it has its own kind of style and its own attractiveness about it that is sort of hard to explain. But it’s very easy to use, and I’ve been reconnecting with friends who I have an email relationship with, but now I see them and talk to them more often on my computer screen than when I just did with email itself.
SREENIVASAN: I think that’s a great way to do it. And whenever you write to someone, make sure you put in a little note explaining why you’re writing and why you’re using this because there are also some other services, including Friendster and Plaxo and all these things, that are just sending out, using your email contacts and connecting you to people sometimes even when you didn’t mean to connect with them. So indicate in some fashion that this is something you are serious about as opposed to some of the other services that you accidentally tried once or just tested out. But, if you’re really into this, let them know, and then your friends will follow you there.
ANDELMAN: Do you have any personal stories of people you’ve reconnected with through Facebook, in particular?
SREENIVASAN: Yes. I reconnected with some of my younger cousins through Facebook. Sometimes -- and this is also an example of how you can be careful about it -- there’s one particular cousin who I connected with, and we’re now emailing a lot more than I did before or Facebooking a lot more than we did before. But I also noticed that, as everyone in her generation, she’s putting up photographs and putting up details of her life that no older cousin should know about, mainly so that I have a kind of plausible deniability from my uncle and aunt. If they ever ask me, “So how is so and so doing, what is she up to?” I can say I don’t know. So I have often gone into people’s photographs which they’ve put and then I suddenly back out and try to erase it from mind’s hard drive.
That’s just one of the ways I’ve been using it, but I’ve also been using it as a great way to communicate with former classmates and also my current students. You can form what are called groups on Facebook, and then you can set up a group, and people will find you, and they’ll populate your pages. And it’s sort of connecting with friends of friends and sharing photographs, and you wonder what did people do before they had this. Well, the answer is they had something else and before that, something else, and before that, something else. And we’ll see if Facebook becomes something that lingers on for a long time or is just a momentary thing the way some other websites were.
Another one I like is linkedin.com. I used to call it “Facebook for Adults,” but that sounds too weird so I call it “Facebook for Professionals.” But like Facebook, which itself has now opened itself out, it was only for college students, but in the last year, it has opened itself out. LinkedIn is very good for business contacts.
SREENIVASAN: I think that is a fair assessment. It isn’t as Web 2.0, if you will. It doesn’t feel as kind of new and constantly being updated, and there aren’t photographs. And that’s one of the things I like about LinkedIn is it’s kind of more professional compared to Facebook.
ANDELMAN: Now, your starting point is the same for both of them. As a matter of fact, for a lot of these services is that, if you want to really get into it, you upload your email contacts from your email program. And then once you get in there, it’s fascinating the way these programs do this. They can actually tell you who know who’s already in their network so you can instantly have a network.
SREENIVASAN: Exactly. And that makes a big difference so that you’re not having to start from scratch every time.
ANDELMAN: The thing that I get asked a lot by, like I’ve got 4,000 contacts in my address book, and I’m kinda working my way through them, inviting them on or seeing if they’re already on. But the people who aren’t on, they worry about a couple things. They worry about, “If I upload my address book is that public knowledge?” They wonder, “Am I giving out private information?” And then what they really want to know is, “How on earth can this benefit me?” How can just having a bunch of people in my network be of benefit? And that’s the question. I guess that’s the first one that I really wanted to ask you about that.
SREENIVASAN: Well, I guess there’s sort of two separate questions there. The first, about whether these services will have access to your email or anything else like that. I wouldn’t use the uploads or contacts feature on some brand new site that I know nothing about, but LinkedIn and Facebook are now two real companies and have business models and have privacy policies in terms of service where they promise not to do things like that. And you kind of end up trusting those people in a way you may not trust someone else.
The other thing is that it’s very hard to explain exactly how it’ll benefit, but being in a network is always helpful. And many of us are already in networks, and we just don’t realize it. We’re okay, well, I’m not a social networker online, but we use it for all kinds of things. You’re part of your high school alumni network, you’re part of your college alumni network. If you’re a season ticket holder and you go to the same seats, you’re in a network of people who sit next to you at every game for whatever team you follow. And being part of networks like that has tremendous benefits offline, and those benefits are amplified and some of the problems are amplified online. So you still have to have a good way of using it, a systematic way of using it, but the easiest way is just to try and keep in touch with your friends and family and your closest friends first. Many people say to me, “I don’t want this because I can barely deal with the friends I already have. I don’t want to make any new friends.” And I tell people, “You don’t have to look at it that way. Look at keeping better touch with the friends you already have.”
My wife and I are an example of this. She and I talk on the cell phone a couple of times a day. We text message each other. We email each other. But we’ve now worked Facebook into our routine. And they have this funny little feature called “Poke Somebody,” and what she’ll do is, instead of sending me an email, she’ll go on Facebook and she’ll poke me. What that does is it’s kind of a nudge or an alert. If I’m available and online, I’ll respond, and then we’ll either have an email, phone, or Facebook conversation. If I’m not there, it’ll alert me that she was looking for me. So it’s a very subtle way of using Facebook. It’s not for everybody. But, as we’ve seen, young people are on this and also older people are on. There are Facebook groups for people over fifty, and it’s not an age thing at all.
SREENIVASAN: Yes, and that’s one of the best things about LinkedIn. I have now taken to using LinkedIn exactly in that fashion. In the old days, that is before a couple years ago, if someone said to me, “I’d like to talk to Bob Andelman,” I would just email you and that person, cc: you and say, “Bob, meet Jim.” You’re stuck because, you’re a decent guy, you will feel some kind of obligation to respond to Jim and partly Jim also has your email address now. So now you’re in this kind of loop with Jim even if you didn’t want to be. So instead Jim says, “I’d like to meet Bob.” What I tell him is go to LinkedIn, find Bob on there, and then connect through me. Jim goes home, sets up a LinkedIn account, and then he emails, using the system, he emails a note to you, but it stops at my desk first. I then decide whether it’s worth connecting Jim to you, and I forward it to you. You then see this note, and you have the option of whether you want to respond or not. And if you decide not to respond, no problem. Jim never got your address. And that’s one of the most basic ways in which this works, and that’s what makes it so useful because your email address has not been compromised by me. You are choosing to respond to him or not. And I know many, many cases where I’ve done this with very busy, very important people, and many of them have appreciated this kind of new way of connecting. And it’s different from yet another email in your inbox so that’s why people are looking into things like this.
ANDELMAN: Now, the way we’re talking about these, people might think that we’re thinking of MySpace as yesterday’s news. Personally, to me, it is yesterday’s news. I find it to be very sloppy, very messy, just way too wild for my taste professionally and personally. Is there a backlash going on for MySpace, or am I just too particular about my friends?
SREENIVASAN: Well, MySpace was bought for $800 million, I believe, by Murdoch and the folks over at News Corp, something in that range. And that was because it was one of the biggest sites on the planet at that time, and it’s still very, very big. But I do find it kind of yesterday’s news, partly because it was never meant for people in my age group. It was aimed at much younger folks even though there are people older than me on it. It didn’t have a sense of aesthetics, design, or a kind of welcoming environment.
When I teach technology to my students, I tell them that I can teach you two of the three T’s, the letter T, T for tools, T for technology. I cannot teach you the third T, which is taste. And when you go to a lot of MySpace pages, they look like they’ve been made in fingerpainting class. And so I never felt comfortable. You go to Facebook, there’s a certain, what we call user interface. It’s got a good user interface. The information architecture is nice. But mainly, it’s intuitive and easy to understand.
One other point I’ll make is when we talk about money and the hundreds of millions of dollars that were offered for MySpace. One of the first of these social networking websites was Friendster. And the founder of Friendster turned down a billion dollar buyout a few years ago, and I believe he’s come to regret it since. And Friendster is nowhere near where Facebook is, but in recent weeks, Facebook has turned down or reportedly turned down a $6 billion buyout offer itself. So it will be interesting to see if Facebook ends up like Friendster or ends up like Google. No one knows where it’s gonna go.
I’d also say that we in America tend to be very eccentric about these things. And something like Friendster is very popular outside of America but not used as much in America. Even Google has a product which has not done well in America called Orkut, which almost no American I know of is on but is huge in Brazil. Literally, if you were trying to have the equivalent of a Super Bowl ad in Brazil, you would get it on Orkut, not on Facebook or Friendster or MySpace. So culturally and for other reasons, some other groups are on other services and not necessarily the ones we’re on today. And that might change again in a couple years.
Click Here to Keep Reading!
©2007 by Bob Andelman. All rights reserved.
Labels: Columbia University Graduate School of Journalism, Facebook, Friendster, LinkedIn, MySpace, Orkut, Plaxo, Poynter Online, Sree Sreenivasan, WNBC
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